WA Radio Scanner Users' Group

gkoutlis wrote:Top pics there mate, I noticed a "First Aid" vehicle on the first pic - in the background - do they have red/blue lights as well???

SJA Operations in victoria have operating red lights/sirens this comes down to that in the event of DISPLAN they are part of the activation.

Markmywords wrote:

gkoutlis wrote:Top pics there mate, I noticed a "First Aid" vehicle on the first pic - in the background - do they have red/blue lights as well???

SJA Operations in victoria have operating red lights/sirens this comes down to that in the event of DISPLAN they are part of the activation.

Cheers for that - Sorry what i meant was - the Volunteer First Aid 4WD in the background of the first pic - ... so it has red lights/sirens???

G

Thats right it looks like a vt station wagon though not a 4wd

All there first aid vans,cars,station wagons pretty much have red lights on all there vehicles and sirens.

I'll be over in melb when they have there royal show so i'll grab some pics and post them up when i get back (its the only time you'll see all of them out all nicely lined up haha)

Markmywords wrote:Thats right it looks like a vt station wagon though not a 4wd

All there first aid vans,cars,station wagons pretty much have red lights on all there vehicles and sirens.

I'll be over in melb when they have there royal show so i'll grab some pics and post them up when i get back (its the only time you'll see all of them out all nicely lined up haha)

Awsome stuff - Thanks so much for letting me know about the light thing... Coz our VFAS vehicles - Mercs, Rodeo, Toyota Landcruser and a Suzuki - All have amber lights - only the suzuki has the old ambulance siren (from the 80's/90's) - Im sure VFAS are actually trying to fight to have the rights for us to have red lights on them - (no sirens req) - I just think amber does nothing - we look more like parking inspectors than First Aid....

Totally agree at the royal show you just see this van with amber lights flashing and you think WTF, even with that old "your dead" siren running no one moves out the way.

I heard a few years back someone crashed the 4wd first aid vehicle from wanneroo they run a red light with the ambers flashing and had a dingle. Dont know how much truth was in it but someone had gone to the first aid branch and took the 4wd out haha.

Markmywords wrote:Totally agree at the royal show you just see this van with amber lights flashing and you think WTF, even with that old "your dead" siren running no one moves out the way.

I heard a few years back someone crashed the 4wd first aid vehicle from wanneroo they run a red light with the ambers flashing and had a dingle. Dont know how much truth was in it but someone had gone to the first aid branch and took the 4wd out haha.

Your right on the mark there mate... - Yes it happend - I don't know who it was, but he thought he'd take it for a drive - without premission, and yeah he rolled it - It was a complete write off - and member has since been kicked out - and charges laid by the police apparantly....

But I'm told the only group stopping VFAS from having red lights - is actually SJA - the big wigs - apparantly.... - not VFAS - but yeah SJA ... So if other states have them, why don't we follow suit - instead of having vehicles looking like Parking Inspectors or worse more - Transit guards lol even though we have the SJA livery all over the cars....

Oh the wonders of politics within a service !!!

Maybe the reason they wont allow red lights is incase of the guy who took the 4wd for a spin i think they call it "flashing light syndrome" and probarly afraid that someone might do the same thing or worse.

What i was told is that VFAS is exactly that first aid not ambulance and you are not designated as a emergency service. If you go back a few years when VFAS got the transits they had the red oscilasers on them for around a year. But were changed due to the fact that people were mistaking them for ambulance when they are first aid posts. From my point of view VFAS does not require them you dont transport and dont respond to emergencies and do not possess ambulance quals. I would actually say that SJA should provide a ambulance to transfer people around the royal show etc. In my opinion if you are operating a sja vehicle with red lights and a siren i would perceive you to be at least an ambulance officer not a first aider. Driver training comes to mind also not qualified in emergency driving. Why dont SJA lift their profile and provide a better service by providing paras to transport and respond to emergencies within the show grounds. Im not hanging shit on the VFAS we all have our calling and responsibilities but first aid is strictly first aid. When VFAS got the snot green uniforms they had a name change to VFAS and a different shoulder badge to help distinguish First aid VS Paramedic.

I know alot of VFAS guys want red and blues and a siren but thats why we have ambulances and Paramedics with years of training and not a two day first aid crse.

My 2cs

Well back ON topic the pics are great when i get a chance i'll take some pics of the MFB and VIc Pol cars when im over there next anyways as i know you guys appreciate those kinda things.

I have to say that VFAS is not about people doing a 2 day first aid course and then letting them run around putting bandaids on people, there alot of long term members who have decent medical backgrounds both dr's and nurses surf life savers off duty A/P and VAO who all operate within the guildlines set down by SJA and do training on a regular basis.

Yes there not an ambulance service but a FIRST aid service who do a pretty good job at the royal show treating at least 100 people a day easy and i totally agree they should have red lights only on there vehicles going through the show grounds is like driving in peak hour traffic kids prams mums dads amber lights dont mean anything so its for a good safety reason. Not them wanting to be wanna be ambulances

There are some members on here who do the VFAS and good on them donating there own time so before you start to do a VFAS bash maybe ask some members rather than what you "heard"

The royal show obviously are happy with what they have in place otherwise they would request an ambulance crew on standby and chances are they wouldnt want to pay for it anyways (nedlands depot isnt far away) and the amount of people being transferred out of the show on a daily basis varies and wouldnt require a fulltime paramedic crew.

gkoutlis wrote: But I'm told the only group stopping VFAS from having red lights - is actually SJA - the big wigs - apparantly.... - not VFAS - but yeah SJA ... So if other states have them, why don't we follow suit - instead of having vehicles looking like Parking Inspectors or worse more - Transit guards lol even though we have the SJA livery all over the cars....

Think you'd find under the law they wouldn't be allowed to have red lights anyway as you are not 'ambulances'.

Mind you, alot of SES vehicles have red and/or red & blue lights and probably shouldn't as they are not primary response for rescue.

From the DPI document Warning Lamps
A guide for installation and operation

Red
Priority Two Emergency
A red flashing lamp warns road users of the presence of an emergency service vehicle associated with a high personal or property threat situation.

Red flashing lamps may only be fitted to vehicles such as Ambulances, Operational Fire Brigade and Bush Fire Brigade vehicles, Mines Rescue vehicles and certain State Emergency Service Vehicles. The lamps shall only be activated when the vehicle is providing active response to an emergency.

Priority Two vehicles should also have the flashing lamp system supplemented with a high volume siren or horn auditory warning system.
Removable red flashing lamps may also be used on some vehicles (eg Medical Doctors) that are infrequently used for responding to emergencies.
These vehicles with removable lamps will not be permitted to have sirens or horn auditory warning systems.

Authorisation is required for vehicles not mentioned, specifically, in the Road Traffic Code or the Road Traffic (Vehicle Standards) Regulations. The
Department will assess requests for authorisation on an individual basis. Suitable driver training is required in all cases. Fire and Emergency Services Authority (FESA) approval is required if authorisation is sought for a fire fighting vehicle.

Vehicles used in this category will usually provide active response that may involve some speed and regular contravention of the normal road rules under special emergency exemption provisions during the period of operation.

From what is being said, the DPI has the final say, not SJA. I also doubt that VFAS members have been given the emergency driver training required.

I guess remembering there looking at the vehicles being used not on the public road and at events, a guy in roleystone has a mazda fire truck (ex fesa) lights sirens and all that he keeps on his property in case of a fire up in the hills. So no reason why they cant have them on and have them covered and then take them off at the event.

The DPI have the last say....i know someone at another ambulance service thats never had emergency driver training not like they insist you carry a bit of paper in your pocket....so the DPI dont really enforce the rules anyways same old thing the goal posts are moved here and there.

Markmywords wrote:I guess remembering there looking at the vehicles being used not on the public road and at events, a guy in roleystone has a mazda fire truck (ex fesa) lights sirens and all that he keeps on his property in case of a fire up in the hills. So no reason why they cant have them on and have them covered and then take them off at the event.

Not unless FESA, then DPI, gives him the OK. Just like me with my ex BFS truck. It has the red and blue beacons (as seen in my pic which was taken on a mate's farm) but my licence states it may only use amber. Hence it only has amber beacons now. The red/blue covers are sitting in my spare room.

Markmywords wrote:The DPI have the last say....i know someone at another ambulance service thats never had emergency driver training not like they insist you carry a bit of paper in your pocket....so the DPI dont really enforce the rules anyways same old thing the goal posts are moved here and there.

Something needs to be done then.

If it's not road registered then theres nothing they can do about the lights on the vehicle. That or if they're covered while on the road - the fire vehicles used out at Barbagallo Raceway all have covers for the lights when they're travelling to/from the raceway.

As for the 'driver training' requirement, the law has no stipulation on that so they wouldn't be able to police it anyway.

Well he definatley doesnt have permission thats for sure lol and its licensed as well you will either see it at his place in roleystone or down at his car scrap metal yard in maddington hence thats the reaosn why he has it as a precaution incase he has a fire in the yard.

But i guess once again comes down to the boys in blue, car yards for ages would allow ambulances to have the lights and sirens on them when up for sale and sold them as is and thats only changed last couple of years cant be sold as an ambulance unless being used as an ambulance and wont be licensed as an ambulance unless they go over the pitts with decals lights and sirens...

But anyways thats for another thread. Its not really policed that well by the DPI and is a trivial matter BUT i have noticed more vehicles with covers over there amber lights.