Criminal Code Amendment Bill 2008 - Assaults on Police

[Fastlane]

Just thought I'd ask what everyone else thinks of the bill introduced into Parliament today that will result in mandatory custodial sentences for those that assault Police and cause bodily harm in doing so? Also appears it will apply to those aged 14 - 18. Does it go far enough or too far ?

There's already talk that the Government has broken an election promise in not providing the same protections to other Public Officers (eg, Ambos, Nurses, Firefighters, Transit Guards, Rangers) although a private members bill from Rob Johnson (current Emerg Services Minister) did prior to the election.

What does everyone think?

[Toottoot]

Time will tell my friend, time will tell.

The problem is if someone spits on an officer they're off to gaol. Which gaol are they planning to put all these people in? They should just go back to the old days and spin around and whack them with their truncheon and send them off home.

[woobla1]

its great

Needs to be tougher in my opinion. There should be a separate bill just for police which is stronger.

And a separate general public service bill, fireman, ambulance etc..

but having said that they should apply mandatory minimums to all crimes. Make it mandatory 1 year for assaults on public, etc.. glassings etc.. none of this good behaviour stuff. Regardless of how 'disadvantaged' your troubled little past has been.

[Fastlane]

Time will tell my friend, time will tell.

The problem is if someone spits on an officer they're off to gaol. Which gaol are they planning to put all these people in? They should just go back to the old days and spin around and whack them with their truncheon and send them off home.

If you read my first comment, it is only where "bodily harm" is caused. I'm yet to see anyone lose an eye from being spat at

[Tyranus]

I'm yet to see anyone lose an eye from being spat at

Can be arranged... I'm sure it's bound to occur at some point on a soccer ground...
anyway i think it's a lot better than what was around. Lets face it if the situation is too dangerous with drunks or so firefighters and ambo's are going to request police to come and remove the people. However it doesn't cover the fire fighters and ambo's if they get attacked out of the blue or in situations similar to the video from over east where the CFA were trying to deal with the burning car.

[canon]

I'm yet to see anyone lose an eye from being spat at

Can be arranged... I'm sure it's bound to occur at some point on a soccer ground...
anyway i think it's a lot better than what was around. Lets face it if the situation is too dangerous with drunks or so firefighters and ambo's are going to request police to come and remove the people. However it doesn't cover the fire fighters and ambo's if they get attacked out of the blue or in situations similar to the video from over east where the CFA were trying to deal with the burning car.

That can happen to anyone and if caught then they would be prosecuted.

[Tyranus]

Ahh but my point is if that happened to a Police officer there would be a minimum sentance/penalty. Where as all the other emergency service workers aren't protected by that, so if you get a timid judge then despite the police doing their best effort to get the person dealt with reasonably they won't be, because they don't have to.

[canon]

Ahh but my point is if that happened to a Police officer there would be a minimum sentence/penalty. Where as all the other emergency service workers aren't protected by that, so if you get a timid judge then despite the police doing their best effort to get the person dealt with reasonably they won't be, because they don't have to.

Totally see your point, but i still think that it would be hard to implement as to where you draw the line. Emergency officers don't have the power to restrain and shouldn't be putting themselves in those situations. Better to call for additional resources than to proceed in a dangerous environment. As for being attacked out of the blue then anyone working anywhere and any member of the public should also be protected

[Tyranus]

. As for being attacked out of the blue then anyone working anywhere and any member of the public should also be protected

Well that's the way it should be, so then do it that way. jeez I should quit IT and become a polititian.

[Fastlane]

Ahh but my point is if that happened to a Police officer there would be a minimum sentence/penalty. Where as all the other emergency service workers aren't protected by that, so if you get a timid judge then despite the police doing their best effort to get the person dealt with reasonably they won't be, because they don't have to.

Totally see your point, but i still think that it would be hard to implement as to where you draw the line. Emergency officers don't have the power to restrain and shouldn't be putting themselves in those situations. Better to call for additional resources than to proceed in a dangerous environment. As for being attacked out of the blue then anyone working anywhere and any member of the public should also be protected

I think an issue is that they are often the first on scene, particularly in rural areas. In fact, in many cases they are the only nearby 'authority' (Rangers are an example of this!). Assaults arent just from trying to restrain someone - quite a few Ambo's and Firefighters get 'fronted up' to when trying to do their jobs.

[canon]

Ahh but my point is if that happened to a Police officer there would be a minimum sentence/penalty. Where as all the other emergency service workers aren't protected by that, so if you get a timid judge then despite the police doing their best effort to get the person dealt with reasonably they won't be, because they don't have to.

Totally see your point, but i still think that it would be hard to implement as to where you draw the line. Emergency officers don't have the power to restrain and shouldn't be putting themselves in those situations. Better to call for additional resources than to proceed in a dangerous environment. As for being attacked out of the blue then anyone working anywhere and any member of the public should also be protected

I think an issue is that they are often the first on scene, particularly in rural areas. In fact, in many cases they are the only nearby 'authority' (Rangers are an example of this!). Assaults arent just from trying to restrain someone - quite a few Ambo's and Firefighters get 'fronted up' to when trying to do their jobs.

Yes it is true that we may be first on scene and many an ambo have also been assaulted by the patient due to their condition. Do we expect them to be charged too? If you are at a scene that isn't safe for whatever reason you simply shouldn't enter or if it becomes unsafe then they should leave until assistance arrives or use their verbal skills to diffuse the situation whilst egressing. I think that in a utopian's world that the law should be implemented for everyone but thats just not going to happen

[Tyranus]

Back in 2005/06 there was an article in the West Australian during the week.

Someone had fallen from a balcony at a party, and 000 was called, all 3 emergency services were dispatched. First to arrive was the ambulance, once the officers started working they were confronted. The casualty was in a fairly criticical condition so required immediate condition. Not long after the ambulance arrived, Fire and Rescue arrived. Due to the casualty being critical and the problems with the crowd, the fire fighters had to form a defensive circle around the cas and ambo's until Police arrived. Yes you could say that the ambo's and firey's should have bailed until the police arrived. But lets face it:
1. An ambulance officer is going to try their best to save the casualty.
2. When you're in the emergency services you tend to go that little bit further.
3. It goes against our natural instinct to let people injure themselves further.
4. When you're working and you get mobbed like the ambo's did it's not necessarily very easy to get out!
I can't remember if it was in WA or not so didn't use SJA, but I have a feeling it was because that was about when police officer shortages was in the news big time (well one of the many times

[canon]

1. An ambulance officer is going to try their best to save the casualty. yep agree
2. When you're in the emergency services you tend to go that little bit further. Scary statement but also true to a point although not a part of any training package quite the opposite.Its a fine line between going a little bit further and being a cowboy and putting not only yourself at risk but your fellow employees.
3. It goes against our natural instinct to let people injure themselves further. Thats a given
4. When you're working and you get mobbed like the ambo's did it's not necessarily very easy to get out! .Agreed

I did hear of that incident but not sure of all the details but if there was a hostile crowd there already , acquired knowledge through training should have prevented the ambos going in. If it was a developing danger then perhaps moving the patient quickly and treating on route would have been the preferred option. unfortunately yes it can happen but at the end of the day you cannot help the patient if you become one yourself. At the end of the day every situation is different and hindsite is a wonderful thing . in this situation i dont doubt that these people dealt with the situation in the best possible way but i also dont doubt that alot would have been learnt from this and strageties would have been put in place to deal with future similar events.

[Toottoot]

Time will tell my friend, time will tell.

The problem is if someone spits on an officer they're off to gaol. Which gaol are they planning to put all these people in? They should just go back to the old days and spin around and whack them with their truncheon and send them off home.

If you read my first comment, it is only where "bodily harm" is caused. I'm yet to see anyone lose an eye from being spat at

You could lose your liver if you end up with Hepatitis.

[canon]

Time will tell my friend, time will tell.

The problem is if someone spits on an officer they're off to gaol. Which gaol are they planning to put all these people in? They should just go back to the old days and spin around and whack them with their truncheon and send them off home.

If you read my first comment, it is only where "bodily harm" is caused. I'm yet to see anyone lose an eye from being spat at

You could lose your liver if you end up with Hepatitis.

Or develop PTSD ( post traumatic spit disorder ) BWAAAAHHHAAAHHHAA oh i kill me lol
Sorry im composed now. Post traumatic stress disorder.