unknown new toy

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dxermouse
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unknown new toy

Post by dxermouse »

Hi everyone im a newbie here and to amateur radio so im not sure if I have posted this in the right area so please bare with me.

Ive received an xmas gift which is a yaesu vx-8dr transceiver. After some google searching and me being confused I ended up here.
My problem is I dont know what I have been given, I have no idea what it is used for, how to use it or what it does, even if I read the manual I have no idea what they are talking about of course I can press the buttons and do what the manual says to get things done but I dont know what the heck it is they are doing or trying to get me to do?

Are there any people, clubs or places in perth that I can goto where someone can show me what it is used for and how it is supposed to be used etc.

looking to hear from anyone who can help
thanks in advance for your replies.
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by robbage »

dxermouse wrote:Hi everyone im a newbie here and to amateur radio so im not sure if I have posted this in the right area so please bare with me.

Ive received an xmas gift which is a yaesu vx-8dr transceiver. After some google searching and me being confused I ended up here.
I guess the obvious question is: are you a licence amateur radio operator? If not, do you want to be?
Rob
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by dxermouse »

robbage wrote: I guess the obvious question is: are you a licence amateur radio operator? If not, do you want to be?
why do I want to be a licensed radio amateur radio operator is it important? Since I seem to be getting the hang of this device and it looks like the software will make it really simple to set up...
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by Zebedee »

dxermouse wrote:
robbage wrote: I guess the obvious question is: are you a licence amateur radio operator? If not, do you want to be?
why do I want to be a licensed radio amateur radio operator is it important?
Yes, it's important as it's illegal to even own that radio, let alone use it.

The federal Radiocommunications Act says:
Unlawful possession of radiocommunications devices

47. Subject to section 49, a person must not, without reasonable excuse, have a radiocommunications device in his or her possession for the purpose of operating the device otherwise than as authorised by:

(a) a spectrum licence; or
(b) an apparatus licence; or
(c) a class licence. Penalty:

(a) if the radiocommunications device is a radiocommunications transmitter:
(i) if the offender is an individual - imprisonment for 2 years; or
(ii) otherwise - $150,000; or

(b) if the radiocommunications device is not a radiocommunications transmitter - $2,000.
So I guess it depends on whether you fancy your chances at being imprisoned for 2 years and/or be $150,000 poorer.

As for the rest of your post, it was inappropriate and has been removed.
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dxermouse
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by dxermouse »

Zebedee wrote:The federal Radiocommunications Act says:
Unlawful possession of radiocommunications devices

47. Subject to section 49, a person must not, without reasonable excuse, have a radiocommunications device in his or her possession for the purpose of operating the device otherwise than as authorised by:

(a) a spectrum licence; or
(b) an apparatus licence; or
(c) a class licence. Penalty:

(a) if the radiocommunications device is a radiocommunications transmitter:
(i) if the offender is an individual - imprisonment for 2 years; or
(ii) otherwise - $150,000; or

(b) if the radiocommunications device is not a radiocommunications transmitter - $2,000.
Wouldn't that mean everyone using a mobile phone would be up for 2 years and people using a common radio would be up for $2000??

Ok on a serious note how long will it take to get a license if the time it takes to get a license + the costs is worth more than the unit am I not better off to sell the unit?
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by yorky »

dxermouse wrote: Wouldn't that mean everyone using a mobile phone would be up for 2 years and people using a common radio would be up for $2000??
Well no because your mobile phone would be under the appropriate license that anyone can use.

Same as CB radio, being under a class that anyone may use, using the appropriate device.
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robbage
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Uniden UBC72XLT handheld
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Two-way
Yaesu VX-3R 2m/70cm Ham TRX and wideband RX handheld
Yaesu FT-1802M 2m Ham TRX mobile x 2
Yaesu FT-7800R 2m/70cm Ham TRX and wide band RX mobile
Icom IC-208H 2m/70cm Ham TRX and wide band RX mobile
Icom IC-706MKIIG all-band all-mode Ham TRX mobile
Icom IC-V85 2m VHF Ham TRX handheld
Wouxun KG-UVD1P VHF/UHF wideband Ham TRX handheld
Wouxun KG-679P VHF wideband Ham TRX handheld
Wouxun KG-713 UHF wideband Ham TRX handheld
Location: Just on the border of your waking mind

Re: unknown new toy

Post by robbage »

Depends... do you want to be an amateur radio operator or do you just want to use the radio because you have it?
The radio is worth about $650 new... is it possible for the purchaser to exchange it for something else such as a decent scanner or a CB that might suit you better?
Rob
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dxermouse
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by dxermouse »

well Ive been watching some youtube videos and like the idea of hiking up the hills. lobbing some massive antenna over some trees to contact people worldwide. what is better for worldwide communication? what is better for Australia wide? CB or vx-8dr?
Do I want the best license you can get how much does it cost etc? Is there is something more sufficient and easier/cheaper to get and what device would I need to be able to transmit from 0 - 99999999999 mhz instead of just the ones they give you??
Exchange is not possible as it was sent from overseas and not worth the hassle and I already have a scanner.
I dont mind getting the license and its no hassle but unfortunately Im also extremely busy and time factor is important ie (a semester long course is out of the question.) Is it possible to get it done in a week?
Sorry for so many questions but do appreciate your replies
robbage
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Scanners/receivers
Diamond Welz WS1000 wideband handheld
Radioshack Pro 28 handheld
Uniden UBC72XLT handheld
Uniden UBC73XLT handheld
Uniden UBC330CRS desktop

Two-way
Yaesu VX-3R 2m/70cm Ham TRX and wideband RX handheld
Yaesu FT-1802M 2m Ham TRX mobile x 2
Yaesu FT-7800R 2m/70cm Ham TRX and wide band RX mobile
Icom IC-208H 2m/70cm Ham TRX and wide band RX mobile
Icom IC-706MKIIG all-band all-mode Ham TRX mobile
Icom IC-V85 2m VHF Ham TRX handheld
Wouxun KG-UVD1P VHF/UHF wideband Ham TRX handheld
Wouxun KG-679P VHF wideband Ham TRX handheld
Wouxun KG-713 UHF wideband Ham TRX handheld
Location: Just on the border of your waking mind

Re: unknown new toy

Post by robbage »

dxermouse wrote:well Ive been watching some youtube videos and like the idea of hiking up the hills. lobbing some massive antenna over some trees to contact people worldwide. what is better for worldwide communication? what is better for Australia wide? CB or vx-8dr?
To talk Australia wide you will need HF (ie below 30 MHz) or a VHF/UHF digital mode that is forwarded via an internet link such as D-STAR, Echolink or IRLP. For HF you can use 27 MHz CB, or with an amateur licence you get 9 different HF bands to use. The digital modes I mentioned require an amateur licence as well. With the most basic amateur licence you get 4 HF bands and you can use Echolink and IRLP. From there you get more privileges with a higher amateur level.
dxermouse wrote:Do I want the best license you can get how much does it cost etc? Is there is something more sufficient and easier/cheaper to get and what device would I need to be able to transmit from 0 - 99999999999 mhz instead of just the ones they give you??
The best thing would be to get the basic licence (Foundation Licence) and see if you like it. The details are here -> http://hamcollege.com.au/wordpress/?page_id=3. Amateur radio is the only way to get a licence to use a wide number of frequencies and modes to talk to all sorts of people (Australia wide and world wide). Most other licences are intended for a particular use.
dxermouse wrote:Im also extremely busy and time factor is important ie (a semester long course is out of the question.) Is it possible to get it done in a week?
Sorry for so many questions but do appreciate your replies
The Foundation licence is a one weekend course and a short exam the next weekend. It's basic electronics and radio. The other courses are approximately 6 months long and are a lot more in-depth radio and electronics. I believe you can do the courses by correspondence with some place over east (not sure).

Also.. the Foundation licence will allow you to use some features of the VX-8DR but not all of them. APRS is not permitted and the 50-54 MHz band is not permitted.
Rob
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by dxermouse »

Thanks for your answers rob. much appreciated..

Not sure I need APRS since I dont know what it does anyway I think I want to try and communicate with people in say USA and Europe would I need 50mhz for that what is so special about 50 to 54 mhz that requires a different license?
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by Zebedee »

dxermouse wrote:well Ive been watching some youtube videos and like the idea of hiking up the hills. lobbing some massive antenna over some trees to contact people worldwide. what is better for worldwide communication? what is better for Australia wide? CB or vx-8dr?
The short answer is "either or both". Direct worldwide communications are possible via radios that operate in the High Frequency (HF) band (which is the band between 3 and 30 MHz). Radio signals head up into the ionosphere and are bent back down towards the earth, giving HF radios a range in the hundreds to thousands of kilometres.

The kind of radio that you have isn't going to be able to do that. It transmits on different frequencies in the VHF and UHF bands (the VHF band is between 30 and 300 MHz, while the UHF band is between 300 and 3000 MHz.)

Generally speaking, you're looking at a range of tens of kilometres for that handheld radio, unless you use some technology to extend the range. Robbage mentioned IRLP and EchoLink - they are two systems that take signals from devices such as the handheld you've got, and send them to other radios via the Internet. With a handheld radio such as the VX-8DR, it's possible to talk to people all over the world, by using one of these systems. You're not talking "direct" like you do with HF communications, but it's a way of getting world-wide communications on a smaller device not usually designed for worldwide use.
Do I want the best license you can get how much does it cost etc? Is there is something more sufficient and easier/cheaper to get and what device would I need to be able to transmit from 0 - 99999999999 mhz instead of just the ones they give you??
There's no licence in the world that'll let you "transmit from 0 - 99999999 MHz", that just doesn't exist. The radio frequency spectrum is chopped up into blocks, for different uses. For example the air band (used by planes and airports) exist in one block, marine radio is in another block, commercial users (taxis, couriers, security companies, and so on) have another block ... you get the idea.

The entry level amateur licence in Australia (called the Foundation licence) would allow you to use the frequencies between 144 and 148 MHz, and between 430 and 450 MHz which your handheld radio is capable of transmitting on. The Foundation level licence also allows you to use some other frequency bands, but they are outside what your radio is capable of. If you're interested in the whole list of what you'd be able to use, you can see it here.
I dont mind getting the license and its no hassle but unfortunately Im also extremely busy and time factor is important ie (a semester long course is out of the question.) Is it possible to get it done in a week? Sorry for so many questions but do appreciate your replies
As Robbage has said, you need to sit an exam that covers some basic radio and electronics theory, some practical demonstrations and some actual on-air operating procedures. The Wireless Institute of Australia are the organisation responsible for examination and qualification of amateur radio operators in Australia. Within WA, there are three organisations in who do both training and examinations: the Scouts have a radio and technology team and conduct training courses for people involved in Scouting, and two amateur radio clubs, the Southern Electronics Group in the Albany region, and Ham College in Perth.

Ham College runs Foundation training courses on the second-last weekend of every second month. The first course for 2011 will be the weekend of 22/23 January, and the exam on the morning of the following Saturday the 29th January. It's highly recommended that people seeking to get a Foundation amateur licence purchase the accompanying manual, either from the WIA directly, or from Ham College.

From the time of doing the course and sitting the examination, licences are usually issued within four to six weeks. All the exam paperwork has to go to Melbourne first, for the WIA to issue you with a Certificate of Proficiency, and then the Australian Communications and Media Authority (federal government department responsible for radio matters in Australia) need to issue you with a licence.

The approximate costs of getting your Foundation licence would be:
$25 for the Foundation Manual
$30 for the Foundation Course
$80 for the exam (including event fee to pay for the venue hire)
$20 for the callsign recommendation from the WIA
$65 for the licence from the ACMA

This comes to a total of $220 if my maths is correct. Ongoing, you just need to pay $65 per year for the ACMA licence.
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by Zebedee »

dxermouse wrote:Not sure I need APRS since I dont know what it does anyway I think I want to try and communicate with people in say USA and Europe would I need 50mhz for that what is so special about 50 to 54 mhz that requires a different license?
APRS is the Automatic Packet Reporting System - it uses a radio and a GPS to find your location and then transmit that location via amateur radio to receiving stations which plot your location on a map. APRS is a digital (ie not voice) radio mode, and isn't something that's permitted by Foundation licence holders. You need the next level up (Standard) before you can use digital modes including APRS. Same goes for access to the 6m band (around 50 MHz that you mentioned). That band is only open to Standard or Advanced grades of amateur licences. In short, the higher your licence level, the more study and training you've done, so more frequency bands, higher power output levels and different types of radio transmissions are allowed... The Foundation licence is a kind of introductory means of getting to know amateur radio. The level of technical and regulatory knowledge required to get that licence level is fairly basic, so the types of transmissions you can make, the frequencies you can use and the power levels you can put out are constrained so people don't get in over their heads :)
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by dxermouse »

Zebedee wrote: The short answer is "either or both". Direct worldwide communications are possible via radios that operate in the High Frequency (HF) band (which is the band between 3 and 30 MHz). Radio signals head up into the ionosphere and are bent back down towards the earth, giving HF radios a range in the hundreds to thousands of kilometres.
What device would I need to purchase to transmit on 3 - 30 Mhz, which is the best device/brand? As I want to communicate world wide but dont want to use internet and such to fake it.
There's no licence in the world that'll let you "transmit from 0 - 99999999 MHz", that just doesn't exist. The radio frequency spectrum is chopped up into blocks, for different uses. For example the air band (used by planes and airports) exist in one block, marine radio is in another block, commercial users (taxis, couriers, security companies, and so on) have another block ... you get the idea.
I meant regardless of license is there some device that exists that has a dial on it that u just scroll up from say 0 - 999999 etc and transmit on any of those numbers whether its local, worldwide, taxis, airband, marine etc?

Again thanks for all your help and I will be heading along on the 22/23 of january
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Re: unknown new toy

Post by Zebedee »

dxermouse wrote:
Zebedee wrote: The short answer is "either or both". Direct worldwide communications are possible via radios that operate in the High Frequency (HF) band (which is the band between 3 and 30 MHz). Radio signals head up into the ionosphere and are bent back down towards the earth, giving HF radios a range in the hundreds to thousands of kilometres.
What device would I need to purchase to transmit on 3 - 30 Mhz, which is the best device/brand? As I want to communicate world wide but dont want to use internet and such to fake it.
Asking an amateur what's "best" is like asking a car enthusiast which car is "best"... You'll inevitably have the Holden supporters, the Ford supporters, and everything in between :P

Two of the major players in the amateur radio market for HF radios are Yaesu and Icom. Examples of HF radios from those two manufacturers would be:
http://www.icom-australia.com/products/ ... -7800.html
http://www.vxstd.com.au/amateur/ftdx_5000_d.html

These are just ones I've picked out at random, they're not necessarily the "best" ones. What's best depends on a lot of factors, everything from what kind of environment you're in to how much you're willing to spend ;)

I meant regardless of license is there some device that exists that has a dial on it that u just scroll up from say 0 - 999999 etc and transmit on any of those numbers whether its local, worldwide, taxis, airband, marine etc?
Not quite although the HF transceivers you can pretty much dial from the bottom to the top of the HF band. Other radios might be locked to only transmit on certain frequencies (e.g. the recognised amateur bands) but allow receive-only operation on a much wider range of frequencies.
Again thanks for all your help and I will be heading along on the 22/23 of january
No worries - best you contact Ham College directly and organise yourself for the January course. There's a cap of about eight people per course due to space limitations, and I know there had been quite a few expressions of interest in attending the January course already!


Cheers,
Doug Bell (Zebedee) VK6DB
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