Radios, bands, licenses and stuff

Jared · Post by **Jared** » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:17 pm

Ok, Being into scanners for only a few months and with no previous radio experience other than the pre programmed fesa cars i really dont know half of what i should. So Im gonna be a big man here and just ask for help.

I have a lot of questions but ill ask one and build on it instead of asking a whole bunch at once.

My only radio knowladge is HOW UHF, HF, MHF radios work

Whats types of radios do you get, (CB, UHF, HF, etc) and what is the difference between them?

Be gentle with me!

Cheers

= J

- Edit by Admin. Changed topic.

Post by **Tyranus** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 11:06 am

Jared,

As you have identified there are a number of different spectrums, starting with a low frequency, going up to the Ultra High Frequencies. Different frequencies react differently under certain conditions. HF for example bounces off the ionisphere (the blue bit above you

)and bounces back down to the ground and back up. As such depending on weather conditions and the radio set being used, on HF you can transmit around the world. SES and WAPOL use HF radios for operations being run out in the country. Check out the amateur license as well.

VHF is used by DEC, FRS, VFRS, BFS, You (your tv pics up off VHF). This is a much shorter range than HF, considered line of sight. I.e. Your tv aerial has to point towards the tv transmitter tower, if there's a building in the way the reception isn't as good.

UHF is even shorter range again, this is more common, as this is what the SES, WAPOL, SJA, CB, TV, Private UHF, are all on. This is more reliant on being line of sight, but like with VHF if you put in a repeater, you can get a lot further.

Jared · Post by **Jared** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:38 pm

So what bands need the license? Does CB need a license cause when in the fesa car, when on duty we used the uhf but when we were off duty and just talking between car to car we used cb.

I know i make things complicated but is there a difference between two ways or is that just an expression for the type of radio used? Like, the little kiddy toy radios from goose bumbs etc what do they run off?

Jared · Post by **Jared** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:48 pm

Speaking right on this topic. I had the most unexpected thing happen. My scanner picked up my cordless house phone while my bro was talking.... First thought was this my weapon of mass destruction

but I only picked up what my brother was saying and not what the phone was receiving.

How does this work???

Post by **Tyranus** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:02 pm

In response to your first question,
You need a license to use an amateur radio set, when you do this you get registered, and get a call sign which you use, much like the VKW200 for SES. Companies that wish to use a frequency for their operations then "borrow" a frequency from ACMA, this frequency is for them to use, in theory all users are ment to have some training, as I'm pretty sure they still have to abide by some rules. CB is free, and you don't require any training or registration fees. I walked into Audiocomm and picked one up with magnetic base and aerial for $460, probably could have been cheaper but so be it.

Second Question, as from SES you'll have been told radio's only allow one person to talk at the same time, but on a phone you can both talk at the same time. So that this can happen your base transmits to the handset on 1 frequency, and the handset back to the base on another, the 2 systems are kept independant in a phone unlike in a radio, where transmitting on one cuts out the receiver. You've managed to lock onto the handset transmitter.

Jared · Post by **Jared** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:12 pm

Ahhhh, right. So to listen to the both way conversation, even though it would be very blotchy and laggy, i would need to store the first frequency and then i could use cc to get the other and store that one... Its a master plan even though it would be rather crap. lol.

So what bands need a license and what dont? Is it just CB that doesnt?

Post by **Tyranus** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:27 pm

In theory yes that could work.

I believe in cases where the radio net is to be used by a large group of people, FESA, SJA, WAPOL, the company that is paying for the block of frequencies holds that license. The 8 CB repeaters are all owned by people, who I believe have the rebroadcast rights given to them by ACMA. A frequency should not be transmitted on if you don't have the authority to transmit on it. I.e I shouldn't go and transmit on a WAPOL frequency without having a legit reason.

Someone with an amateur license might be able to do a better job at explaining the licensing side of things.

Jared · Post by **Jared** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:49 pm

Right, but as i said before. You can get things like kids walkie talkies and things like that which obviously dont require a licenes, (otherwise no one would buy them) So do you know how they work? Or again are walkie talkies completly different?

Post by **Tyranus** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:08 pm

Kids walkie talkies, are set to only use the one frequency but the output is very very low, and so shouldn't cause any interference. I'm not sure how this fits in with ACMA, they may not be concerned about anything under a certain power rating.

Jared · Post by **Jared** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 8:21 pm

Right, that does make sense. So the frequency range on a scanner is determined by its power capabilities?

What does Cb stand for?

Thanks dude, your a champ mate

WPXZBP · Post by **WPXZBP** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 8:37 pm

Jared wrote:Right, that does make sense. So the frequency range on a scanner is determined by its power capabilities?

No... the frequency band is determined by the manufacturer and what they think the consumer wants to listen to. (In the US they are also governed by what the Federal Communications Commission says they can't listen to.

Jared wrote:What does Cb stand for?

CB = Citizens' Band
ACMA = Australian Communications and Media Authority

In Australia it is illegal to listen to any telecommunications without legal authority. This includes mobiles, portable phones etc

Jared · Post by **Jared** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 8:56 pm

Right, ok. So does the power along with the type of band determine the range the radio can reach, dependent along with other things like los

WPXZBP · Post by **WPXZBP** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 9:16 pm

Jared wrote:Right, ok. So does the power along with the type of band determine the range the radio can reach, dependent along with other things like los

Yes but the antenna does too. Connecting a piece of wet string to a transmitter won't give you much range and will probably destroy the electronics. A well designed antenna appropriate for the frequencies used will give you much better range.

As for scanners similar applies. A good antenna will "hear" better than a bad one. The power output of the transmitter will affect how well you receive them. For example you probably won't be able to hear WAPOL in Broome transmitting on UHF no matter how good the antenna you have as they will be using maybe 20 watts of power into a small vertical antenna. The radio signal will essentially peter out well before it gets to your antenna, and hence, your scanner.

Jared · Post by **Jared** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 9:21 pm

Yeah, makes sense. Thats it for now dude. Cheers, Im sure ill find something else to ask in a day or two but for now im right.

Thanks a bunch WP and Tran

Rockjet · Post by **Rockjet** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 9:30 pm

Great info guys, I certainly learnt some interesting stuff, thanks